Transvox - The final few days before the US election

[00:00:08] Hi y'all and welcome back to Transvox and you'll suggest from my amazing American accent that we're going to be talking American politics. How are you Jenny on the internet? Are you well?

[00:00:22] I'm very well thanks. I'm glad you clarified that. I wasn't sure whether you were having some sort of turn then.

[00:00:27] Listen I'm wearing the boots. I've got the hat on.

[00:00:30] You're a woman of many voices.

[00:00:32] All of them the same.

[00:00:33] All of them slightly Geordie it seems but you know.

[00:00:38] I guess there could be an American that grew up in Newcastle.

[00:00:44] I don't know. Welcome Gill. Good to see you.

[00:00:47] Yeah I was in the States a couple of years ago doing a road trip and I went to Dollywood and all the places down south.

[00:00:53] I think we might have talked about it before but they do have this amazing accent you know in my truck on the internet.

[00:01:01] And it's exactly like the accents you hear on television but it would be wouldn't it because they are authentic American accents.

[00:01:07] That's very funny.

[00:01:08] Yeah but it's interesting isn't it accents. I mean it's obviously much more massive than the UK but our accents change within 30-40 miles.

[00:01:19] I don't think that happens in the States. They literally go 50 miles from me and you sound different Manchester or Birmingham.

[00:01:25] I think UK has very small areas rather than like a southern accent and northern accent in America.

[00:01:34] Well it can change between Birmingham, Wolverhampton and Doodley can't it?

[00:01:38] I mean if you hear something.

[00:01:39] Yes.

[00:01:40] Yeah.

[00:01:40] Yeah definitely. It's quite weird in the UK I think.

[00:01:43] Maybe. But maybe that's just my own bias and it's the same in every country and you just don't realise it.

[00:01:49] Well talking of bias let's talk American politics and because actually.

[00:01:54] Oh how joyful.

[00:01:54] We're recording this a week before the American election actually five or six days beforehand and it's looking too close to call and all the pundits are getting hysterical about it.

[00:02:09] And I think from our community's perspective what we're seeing is the trans community well and truly front and centre in the campaign from the GOP aren't they?

[00:02:18] We are definitely public enemy number three I'd say after immigrants and the Democrats.

[00:02:26] Oh definitely it seems to be as far as the Republicans go.

[00:02:30] I mean you know I'd argue that this election this election in America it's you know it almost ranks up with our general election in terms of potential impact on the community.

[00:02:42] Because what happens in the US influences so much what happens in this country.

[00:02:47] We've seen how they've influenced anti-trans rhetoric over here.

[00:02:52] And it is absolutely scary.

[00:02:55] I mean the Republicans have doubled down Trump has doubled down on and seen it as a wedge between the two parties to attack the Democrats on their on what he says is their support for trans people.

[00:03:07] Albeit it's you know yeah so they're using it to attack the Democrats.

[00:03:14] You know I think I read about for instance about the key point about the fact that Kamala Harris is supporting some trans immigrant trans prisoners to have gender reassignment surgery.

[00:03:28] Which nothing's changed on that.

[00:03:30] It's always been the case for some prisoners have been allowed if medically to have that.

[00:03:35] I think it happened under Trump as well.

[00:03:37] It's just nobody talked about it.

[00:03:39] Like I said and it's a handful of prisoners that have done that but it's suddenly become this issue.

[00:03:44] It's not the issue of trying they talk all the time about keeping men out of women's sport as if it's a massive problem across America.

[00:03:52] And it just isn't you know there are some college sports where some young trans people have been involved.

[00:03:59] But they talk about it as if it's the major women's issue in the United States.

[00:04:04] It's absolutely crazy.

[00:04:05] You know.

[00:04:08] And the thing is once it's clear that the Democrats are more accepting, more inclusive such like but they've not been as robust.

[00:04:19] They've sort of sidestepped the issue and I think that's probably the old that is the thing to do with the big issue.

[00:04:25] It's just a sidestepped.

[00:04:26] But when Ted Cruz released an ad around boys and girls sports and such like and supporting sterilisation of children,

[00:04:38] the Democrats didn't rebut that comment.

[00:04:42] And they haven't been strong there.

[00:04:45] And I think what they've done is by not being strong, they've given the Republicans more cause for concern.

[00:04:51] But I can see why they're not doing it because actually by not talking about it, it stops it becoming an issue.

[00:04:57] Because once both sides join in and then we really do get caught in the middle of a storm, don't we?

[00:05:02] So I guess this is where I'd slightly I could sit.

[00:05:05] I see that rationale.

[00:05:06] I don't think it's the right one.

[00:05:08] They're going to be they're going to be accused of supporting trans people anyway.

[00:05:11] So they might as well just, you know, and the Democratic base doesn't want that.

[00:05:16] You know, they might as well just say, yeah, we support trans health care.

[00:05:21] We support LGBTQ plus people.

[00:05:23] They might as well say that because they're going to be it was the same with the Labour Party.

[00:05:27] They're going to accuse you of that anyway.

[00:05:29] I mean, I think the noticeable difference to me is I think it feels to me that Kamala Harris has been much more quiet on the subject other than rebutting it.

[00:05:38] Then I found that one thing about Joe Biden is he was explicitly he made a point of being explicitly supportive of trans people.

[00:05:46] In appointing trans people to his cabinet and, you know, making statements on trans day of visibility, for instance, that he, you know, that politicians in this country didn't.

[00:05:57] But he made a presidential declaration or some sort of thing that they do.

[00:06:00] So it always struck me that he was even though I think in his past voting wasn't necessarily he voted in the right way in his historically.

[00:06:08] But certainly in the recent years feels to me that he's been explicitly saying, yeah, I am positive and supportive of trans people.

[00:06:17] And I think Kamala Harris has been much quieter on that.

[00:06:20] Very quiet.

[00:06:21] In fact, actually, Josh Shapiro is and Tim Walz both come with a sort of a track record of supporting trans people.

[00:06:29] Yeah.

[00:06:29] But this sort of step back a little bit, although Walz did actually call out GOP leaders for demonising trans people.

[00:06:37] But I think Kamala Harris had two recent interviews.

[00:06:41] And I think Hallie Jackson from NBC specifically asked her to outline her feelings on gender affirming care.

[00:06:48] And Harris only said that we should follow the law.

[00:06:51] And of course, and of course, whilst the law, you know, does require anyone in state of federal custody receive all the necessary medical care, including gender affirming care.

[00:07:01] It's it's it's not really reassuring, is it?

[00:07:04] But I still think it's this Ming Van strategy that the Labour Party had, which is basically you turn it into a non-issue.

[00:07:11] And actually, there's possibly more.

[00:07:15] But you're right.

[00:07:16] I mean, you know, you have a choice, don't you, when you're running a political party?

[00:07:20] It's where do you want to engage the argument?

[00:07:22] And I think if the Democrats engage the argument on trans people, they're stopping engaging the argument on abortion.

[00:07:28] And they've got more chance of winning on abortion than they have on on trans issues.

[00:07:33] Maybe, maybe, maybe so.

[00:07:35] And who am I strategically that man?

[00:07:37] I think I personally think it's wrong.

[00:07:39] I think you I think the easier way to head that argument off is making the positive case and then leaving it there, you know, making the positive case.

[00:07:46] You know, we've supported trans people have been supported, you know, trans transitioning through health care for many years now and were through Trump's presidency as well.

[00:07:56] He didn't change the law, did he?

[00:07:58] Federally, he didn't change the law.

[00:07:59] So that's never that's not been an issue.

[00:08:03] And you go up front and say, of course we do, just as we.

[00:08:06] And then they say, well, you know, some of the gops could disagree.

[00:08:09] But, yeah, they disagree on abortion.

[00:08:11] I think you can head the argument off a little bit more than just say, say, say not a great deal and letting the Republicans again and again misrepresent the issue.

[00:08:21] You know, they've misrepresented Tim Walz by saying that he was.

[00:08:26] I mean, effectively, they were saying that kids were forcibly transitioned at school when they were at school.

[00:08:34] It's just utter nonsense.

[00:08:36] It's utter nonsense.

[00:08:37] Wasn't Trump say something like you go to school and you'll have a sex change and come back the next day?

[00:08:42] It's absolute.

[00:08:44] None of it is.

[00:08:45] It's absolute crazy talk.

[00:08:47] Fantasy, you know.

[00:08:47] But, you know, so you just think that's absolutely crazy.

[00:08:51] What all Tim Walz said is that we would make sure that trans kids were protected, you know, if they came to Wisconsin, wasn't it?

[00:09:00] So, you know, whereas some, you know, some states are trying to bully trans kids out of existence and trans adults.

[00:09:07] So it is absolutely nuts.

[00:09:10] I just think it's the wrong approach.

[00:09:11] And ultimately, if you've got principles of equality, the idea that we just all, you know, move to the middle with our politics for fear of scaring it.

[00:09:22] I don't know.

[00:09:23] I mean, to a degree, and probably not the place to get into that debate, but similarly on matters like Gaza and immigration, they've moved to the centre because they're trying to get Republican voters.

[00:09:35] But they risk losing some of their base.

[00:09:38] They risk losing, you know, they're risking losing some of their actual support.

[00:09:43] You know, that young people might go, well, actually, that's what happened to the Labour Party here.

[00:09:49] Seems there's a lot of parallels between the way the Republicans are approaching it.

[00:09:53] The Democrats and the Labour Party in this country are both led by prosecutors, interestingly, or experts.

[00:09:59] Yeah.

[00:09:59] Well, it's that thing about rather than going out and winning, it's about not losing, isn't it?

[00:10:03] And I think that affects strategy.

[00:10:05] It's interesting that Kamala Harris has spent, I think, has spent far too much time talking about Trump instead of talking about a new vision for the country.

[00:10:13] I mean, Reagan came to power with the old, the shining white castle on the hill, didn't he?

[00:10:18] Yeah.

[00:10:18] And that's the idea of creating a vision for the future.

[00:10:20] And that's how you separate yourself and step away from Biden if you want to do, is you create and you say, this is what we want.

[00:10:26] But I think psychologically what they do is they do this thing about we don't want to lose.

[00:10:30] We don't want to offend.

[00:10:32] We don't want everything we don't want to rather than we want to do these things.

[00:10:36] And they could be talking about a country where you can go to and, you know, fulfill the American dream.

[00:10:42] I mean, for goodness sake, it's the thing they all bang on about all the time is they stand.

[00:10:46] And it's quite interesting.

[00:10:47] You listen to immigrant, you know, MAGA people talking about the fact that they went there and did the American dream as immigrants,

[00:10:53] but no other immigrants are allowed because they're a scourge in the country.

[00:10:56] And it's about you have to make that argument clearly.

[00:10:59] However, that being said, I think as a strategy, I sort of don't care what what they do and say as long as they get in.

[00:11:08] Because actually, I think the thought of a Trump presidency is so horrendous.

[00:11:12] I'm sort of, I'm sort of, I'm sort of, I'm sort of withing that.

[00:11:16] I think, you know, for what's going to go on the world, it's staggered.

[00:11:22] They're already plotting to bring, you know, internally to trash the American economy.

[00:11:26] What they're going to do that.

[00:11:28] Well, it's an existential threat to the world is Trump.

[00:11:32] I mean, it's, I mean, I think it's difficult to compare from, you know, even like Reagan,

[00:11:37] because one, there has never been anybody so extreme as Trump and so completely unsuited in every measure.

[00:11:44] And so, you know, not only the worst person standing to be present,

[00:11:49] almost the worst person in the whole of America to be present.

[00:11:51] I mean, a terrible individual, any measure.

[00:11:56] But so that's so extreme is how do you deal with that?

[00:11:59] That somebody that's prepared to lie all the time becomes very difficult to deal with.

[00:12:04] Because, you know, it will just continue to lie on it.

[00:12:07] And to continue, I mean, that last rally they had in Manhattan,

[00:12:11] where they had a comedian being raped, you know, there was an amount of racism.

[00:12:15] And it was in the same, it was in the same venue as the Nazi,

[00:12:19] the American sort of, the fascist Nazi rally that they had, you know,

[00:12:24] before just in the Second World War.

[00:12:26] I mean, it was the same venue.

[00:12:27] And whether that was deliberate or not.

[00:12:30] If you look at the Agenda 47 website, which is stated Trump policy,

[00:12:36] and it's on wiki, it's drawn from some of the, you know,

[00:12:40] heritage 2025 stuff, you see what they're about.

[00:12:44] And it's front and centre.

[00:12:45] They're completely explicit.

[00:12:47] This is what we're going to do.

[00:12:49] And the idea they're going to bring in a South African

[00:12:51] to basically take their own government down.

[00:12:54] How much are you going to save Elon?

[00:12:55] He said, oh, two trillion, one million, two trillion.

[00:12:58] Oh, two trillion.

[00:12:59] He's going to wipe out of the national debt.

[00:13:01] I mean, this is just madness.

[00:13:03] This is what the Argentinians did, didn't they,

[00:13:05] when they brought in their newest.

[00:13:07] It's just worth, I mean, he's just plainly the con of him being intelligent

[00:13:14] in any way is just, I mean, he is just an idiot, isn't he?

[00:13:18] I don't know.

[00:13:19] I don't know if he's an idiot.

[00:13:20] I think he is.

[00:13:21] I think in some, clearly he has got some skills, I guess, business skills,

[00:13:26] but he's built everything on the backs of other people.

[00:13:29] But he'll just say anything, you know, because he'll just say that.

[00:13:32] Look what he's done to Twitter, he's completely trashed it, you know.

[00:13:35] Yeah.

[00:13:36] But yeah, but he's having influence and been promised a job.

[00:13:39] But of course he just, oh, I'll save two trillion.

[00:13:41] No, it doesn't mean anything.

[00:13:42] He's just throwing a number in, you know.

[00:13:44] It's not thought out whether we do that.

[00:13:47] I mean, it is an existential threat to the world, you know,

[00:13:52] in the foreign policy issue.

[00:13:55] It's really interesting because, again, Trump's painting himself

[00:13:59] like some sort of peace president, isn't he?

[00:14:02] And saying that the Democrats are warmongering

[00:14:04] because they're supporting Ukraine

[00:14:05] and he would solve the Ukraine problem tomorrow.

[00:14:08] Well, what he would do, he would sell Ukraine out, wouldn't he?

[00:14:11] He would sell them out to Russia.

[00:14:13] So, but it's the scary stuff on trends within our community

[00:14:19] that I think is most worrying.

[00:14:20] The fact that it's the first thing, almost the first or second thing

[00:14:23] they'll say at a rally or any sort of, I was unfortunate enough to see,

[00:14:31] I think it was Jake Paul, that YouTuber coming out in, I saw it on YouTube.

[00:14:41] Somebody was reacting to it and all they talked about was trans people.

[00:14:46] That's all they talked about.

[00:14:47] One percent of the population he was talking about, you know,

[00:14:50] trans people in support and sharing bathrooms.

[00:14:52] And saying, I'm not a trans, I don't hate trans people.

[00:14:55] Well, then he says, you know, you don't want them in the bathroom.

[00:14:57] Yeah.

[00:14:58] Well, what's interesting is there's a new sort of shift.

[00:15:02] I think even in the last two or three days about this new phrase

[00:15:06] that Trump has massively advertised right across the southern half of the US

[00:15:11] and right across NFL.

[00:15:13] And they've got a really, actually, it's very clever.

[00:15:15] Kamala is for their them.

[00:15:17] Trump is for you.

[00:15:18] But it's interesting because apparently, according to polling,

[00:15:25] because it's only one percent of the US population,

[00:15:27] most people aren't that interested or motivated.

[00:15:30] It never appears as a top issue at all.

[00:15:34] But what they're doing here is because they know they can't,

[00:15:37] they have to take the attention away from abortion.

[00:15:39] So that's why they're doing it.

[00:15:41] Oh, yeah.

[00:15:42] I mean, absolutely.

[00:15:44] And everything else.

[00:15:45] But, I mean, I think it's that.

[00:15:47] But I think it's more than that.

[00:15:48] I mean, they're misjudging it.

[00:15:49] They've used it as a wedge issue,

[00:15:50] but it never comes anywhere near the top four or five concerns of people.

[00:15:54] And neither should it.

[00:15:55] It's not a concern for people.

[00:15:57] It never has been.

[00:15:58] And do you know what the latest thing is they're up to?

[00:16:00] This is the sort of the hollowness of the whole argument,

[00:16:04] which I find quite odd.

[00:16:05] They're now deciding to ban puberty blockers.

[00:16:08] And where are they getting the research for this?

[00:16:10] They're getting it from the Cass review.

[00:16:14] Yeah.

[00:16:15] Which was, in fact, you know, partly funded or partly consulted with the right-wing extremists

[00:16:20] as part of what's-his-face's research in Florida.

[00:16:24] I mean, the whole thing is just a massive stitch up here.

[00:16:28] And it is.

[00:16:31] But somehow someone in a very senior place, maybe it's Putin or something,

[00:16:36] has found himself having a date with a trans person by mistake one day,

[00:16:39] and he's taken against it really badly, and he's decided to get even.

[00:16:43] Because, you know, I see Putin behind quite a lot of this sort of funding in China as well.

[00:16:47] And it just makes you wonder what this concerted attack is for.

[00:16:52] Well, it's definitely true.

[00:16:54] The thing you've just said is definitely true for Elon Musk,

[00:16:57] because he has a trans daughter, and he objected to that,

[00:17:00] and that set him off on this.

[00:17:02] He used to support him, though.

[00:17:03] Oh, yeah, but he used to be more liberal.

[00:17:06] He's just, you know, there's no morals to his principles.

[00:17:13] I wonder if the multi-billion contract they've got with the government

[00:17:17] to provide space exploration has anything.

[00:17:20] Even Jeff Bezos, apparently, is saying that he's pitching for government contracts now,

[00:17:24] and that's why he's now, you know, didn't back the Democrats,

[00:17:28] but also is moving in a more right-wing area.

[00:17:31] Strange that.

[00:17:32] Well, isn't it?

[00:17:33] Because he owns the Wall Street Journal.

[00:17:35] No, not the Washington Post.

[00:17:38] Washington Post, sorry.

[00:17:39] Yeah, he owns the Washington Post, and the Washington Post,

[00:17:41] for the first time in their history, are not supporting a candidate.

[00:17:45] Cowards.

[00:17:46] Which clearly they would, if you look at their article and their politics,

[00:17:49] it would be the Democrats.

[00:17:50] And they've lost, I think somebody said they lost 100,000 subscribers

[00:17:53] straight away on that.

[00:17:55] Good.

[00:17:55] But it's because they all want contracts.

[00:17:57] They're all hedging their bets on that if Trump gets in.

[00:18:00] They don't want, because he's so thin-skinned, you know, he's so venal,

[00:18:03] he would just, you know, cut people's contracts.

[00:18:06] He threatened to do that with Amazon.

[00:18:08] There was some issue about the Washington Post,

[00:18:11] and he threatened to cut some Amazon contracts.

[00:18:14] I mean, I'm no massive fan of Amazon and some of the practices,

[00:18:17] but it is crazy, crazy time.

[00:18:22] And, you know, I've never been more invested in a US election

[00:18:27] than I am right now.

[00:18:28] Yeah.

[00:18:29] You can see a really catastrophised thing with, you know,

[00:18:33] and I think there'll be trouble, whoever wins,

[00:18:36] over the course of the next few weeks and months.

[00:18:38] Because the thing, I think the fact that if the Trump mob have said this

[00:18:42] so far ahead in the polls, so if they don't win,

[00:18:46] they can claim it's a fix.

[00:18:47] And they've got all these legal cases already lodged,

[00:18:51] saying there's been election fraud.

[00:18:53] But the only incident so far has been the Republican vote stuffing so far.

[00:18:57] But I think there's going to be trouble at the hill.

[00:18:59] But if they do gain, we're going to have massive tariffs.

[00:19:02] We're going to have NATO run by someone that's anti-NATO.

[00:19:06] We're going to have China in Taiwan.

[00:19:07] We're going to have the end of Ukraine.

[00:19:09] We're going to have potentially Russia moving in on other states.

[00:19:12] Hungary, potentially, right across that suede.

[00:19:15] We're going to have a period of massive uncertainty.

[00:19:17] And I think, to be honest with you, the cost of living crisis,

[00:19:20] the inflation crisis, the debt cycle is going to be so high.

[00:19:24] I think, to be honest, trans issues are going to be at the bottom

[00:19:26] of most people's worry.

[00:19:28] No, I think they are anyway.

[00:19:30] But it's not wrong for us to worry about.

[00:19:32] Oh, we have to.

[00:19:33] Yeah, of course.

[00:19:34] Because when you said, look, where's this all come from?

[00:19:36] We know the links between the fundamental Christian,

[00:19:41] the Christian nationalists and anti-trans groups in this country.

[00:19:46] They've been well recorded, those links.

[00:19:49] So a lot of support has come that way from what's happening in the UK.

[00:19:53] And so they're using the CAS report and things like that.

[00:19:58] There's a lot of those.

[00:20:01] We know that's happening.

[00:20:03] And that's not going to change whoever wins, I guess, in of itself.

[00:20:08] Just you're not likely to get any federal laws, I think.

[00:20:11] I would hope if the Democrats win.

[00:20:13] I don't know that there would be necessarily trouble

[00:20:15] if the Republicans won and won a majority.

[00:20:18] I can't see the Democrats behaving in that same way.

[00:20:23] And I don't think you'll get another January the 6th.

[00:20:27] I don't think you'll get another thing quite like that.

[00:20:30] But they're definitely preparing the ground.

[00:20:32] I mean, I've certainly seen some reporters about the fact that some of the polling is biased,

[00:20:38] deliberately so, to skew the overall, because it's really tight at the moment

[00:20:43] to maybe skew the overall polling.

[00:20:45] So there is a hope.

[00:20:47] And there's also, I think I've also heard that potentially,

[00:20:50] because it's been perceived that the pollsters got it wrong in 2016,

[00:20:55] and then in 2022, they sort of got it wrong,

[00:20:58] that their models have been changed slightly to favour the Republicans a bit more

[00:21:03] because it was felt it was underscoring them.

[00:21:06] And maybe there's been an overcorrection.

[00:21:08] And that's sort of my hope, because it is so close.

[00:21:10] It could be a few thousand votes in Pennsylvania.

[00:21:15] It could mean catastrophe.

[00:21:18] And it genuinely would be a catastrophe in the world.

[00:21:22] It doesn't almost bear thinking about.

[00:21:24] I mean, last time was...

[00:21:26] And to add this, and I think even more worrying,

[00:21:29] it's interesting.

[00:21:30] I was listening to Anthony Scaramucci and Cathy Kaye on Arrested Politics US.

[00:21:35] And Anthony Scaramucci is quite...

[00:21:37] I mean, it's something he said.

[00:21:38] It's not something I would say, but he says,

[00:21:39] is Americans are not keen on having a woman president.

[00:21:43] It's as simple as that.

[00:21:45] It's that the vast majority of women...

[00:21:47] And, you know, sorry, the vast majority of them

[00:21:50] do not want a female president,

[00:21:52] especially across that sort of Rust Belt area.

[00:21:54] Now, that's an American saying that.

[00:21:56] I buy it, actually, because having been in the States,

[00:21:59] you know, women's rights are miles behind.

[00:22:00] What I don't understand is women not voting for a woman.

[00:22:04] But then, of course, we don't know what's going to go on behind the scenes.

[00:22:07] And sadly, even though Swifty and Beyonce have endorsed Kamala,

[00:22:11] it's not pushing...

[00:22:12] It's not cutting through.

[00:22:13] Because, actually, Trump is very good at campaigning

[00:22:16] and probably better than Kamala Harris.

[00:22:18] I don't...

[00:22:19] It'd be interesting to see, because it's difficult to tell,

[00:22:22] because we're just basing it on the polls.

[00:22:23] We're still basing it on the polls, aren't we?

[00:22:25] So it is difficult to say whether...

[00:22:27] Trump is good about activating his base.

[00:22:30] I don't think Trump's very good about reaching beyond his base.

[00:22:33] I don't think he's persuading many independents.

[00:22:38] I would take issue with the vast majority of people

[00:22:41] who don't want a woman.

[00:22:42] I think there is...

[00:22:43] I think there's a number of people that maybe don't want

[00:22:45] to see a woman president.

[00:22:47] I don't know if it's a vast majority.

[00:22:49] It wouldn't be so...

[00:22:50] I mean, Hillary won the popular vote, don't forget.

[00:22:52] She won more votes in America than Donald Trump won.

[00:22:55] She just didn't win the Electoral College.

[00:22:57] And I think Kamala's taken a conscious effort

[00:23:01] to not campaign in terms of identity,

[00:23:03] in terms of being the first woman

[00:23:05] or for the first black president.

[00:23:08] You know, to take a conscious effort

[00:23:10] to not talk about that.

[00:23:12] Whereas I think Hillary did talk a lot more

[00:23:14] about being potentially the first president.

[00:23:17] But she did win.

[00:23:18] He's never won the popular vote, Trump.

[00:23:21] So, you know, that's the big hurdle to get over

[00:23:24] for the Democrats as the system is rigged.

[00:23:28] And it is interesting because I was reading an article

[00:23:31] about the...

[00:23:32] I forget the name of the person.

[00:23:33] It was back at JF Kennedy time.

[00:23:36] And they had some senator who started to look

[00:23:38] at the Electoral College system and saying how unfair it was

[00:23:41] because actually there had been a track record

[00:23:43] of the least popular president winning the presidency

[00:23:46] because of the Electoral College thing.

[00:23:47] And then surprise, surprise, the Republicans,

[00:23:49] they all agreed, basically,

[00:23:50] they should just go straight on the popular vote.

[00:23:52] And it was kicked out by the Republicans

[00:23:54] who were frightened that the black people,

[00:23:57] the black population would have too much power.

[00:23:59] And, you know, it's this sustenance,

[00:24:02] the maintenance of white male privilege

[00:24:04] has been really at the bedrock

[00:24:06] for the last 50 years in America.

[00:24:07] I had a great argument on this,

[00:24:09] is, you know, the Republicans will go,

[00:24:14] rage against EDI, you know,

[00:24:16] rage against equality, equity, diversity, and inclusion.

[00:24:20] But I've seen the argument made

[00:24:25] is doing that because it's giving extra power

[00:24:30] to rural parts of America.

[00:24:33] Because that's what it does.

[00:24:34] Those states that vote,

[00:24:36] the vote red, that vote for the Republicans,

[00:24:38] they are given more power in the Electoral College.

[00:24:41] Their votes are worth more.

[00:24:42] They're worth more, yeah.

[00:24:43] than votes in the cities.

[00:24:46] So there is a,

[00:24:47] there isn't a level playing field.

[00:24:48] One vote doesn't equal.

[00:24:50] So, you know, that,

[00:24:51] you could see that as positive action

[00:24:52] that was done to make sure

[00:24:54] that those rural areas

[00:24:57] were not disadvantaged

[00:24:58] because they haven't got as many people.

[00:25:00] Yeah, it wasn't for that reason.

[00:25:01] But that's not the reason it was done.

[00:25:03] And, you know,

[00:25:04] it was done, I presume,

[00:25:05] to get the states on board

[00:25:06] with the Electoral College

[00:25:08] to, you know,

[00:25:09] to find a way of doing that.

[00:25:10] Partly because of population disparities

[00:25:12] and the black population.

[00:25:13] Because remember,

[00:25:14] you know,

[00:25:14] the Civil War was fought

[00:25:16] around the black population

[00:25:17] and economics,

[00:25:18] you know,

[00:25:18] all the way through.

[00:25:20] And if you look at,

[00:25:21] you know,

[00:25:21] what they're talking about

[00:25:22] with the mass immigration deportations

[00:25:25] and what they're talking about

[00:25:26] is going back to legislation

[00:25:29] before all the amendments

[00:25:30] on the original constitution,

[00:25:32] they're talking about

[00:25:33] rolling back black equality

[00:25:35] and women's rights.

[00:25:38] Just read Agenda 47.

[00:25:39] It is hair-raising.

[00:25:41] Oh, it is definitely scary.

[00:25:44] But I really like the argument

[00:25:45] that the thing that keeps,

[00:25:47] that's kept you in power

[00:25:48] or given you power as Republicans

[00:25:50] is a system that seeks

[00:25:52] to give advantage

[00:25:55] to certain communities.

[00:25:56] I don't think they're into irony over there.

[00:25:59] No, they're not.

[00:26:00] They're not.

[00:26:01] They're not into that.

[00:26:02] But yeah,

[00:26:04] I think I love those arguments.

[00:26:06] It was,

[00:26:06] I think it was partly on,

[00:26:08] I don't know if you saw that,

[00:26:09] there was a brilliant video

[00:26:10] of the notorious YouTuber,

[00:26:12] Ben Shapiro,

[00:26:13] who has a massive platform

[00:26:15] and rails against trans people.

[00:26:17] And he was doing this event

[00:26:18] where I think he was sort of debating

[00:26:21] with a load of Democratic supporters

[00:26:23] one by one

[00:26:24] and they'd come to sit in mind.

[00:26:25] And this trans man came

[00:26:26] to sit opposite him.

[00:26:28] He didn't realise

[00:26:28] it was a trans man.

[00:26:30] And he absolutely got to do it.

[00:26:32] He didn't know where to go

[00:26:33] with his arguments on it

[00:26:35] because he got a trans man

[00:26:36] that he called brother

[00:26:37] or something at the start.

[00:26:39] And then he desperately

[00:26:39] didn't want to correctly gender

[00:26:41] the person

[00:26:42] because he doesn't,

[00:26:43] he doesn't agree with it.

[00:26:44] And it is a beautiful watch

[00:26:46] to watch somebody

[00:26:46] who's just be taken apart

[00:26:48] by logic,

[00:26:49] you know,

[00:26:50] because that's the thing

[00:26:51] with the transphobes.

[00:26:52] They don't think trans men exist.

[00:26:54] Seems to be.

[00:26:55] They hate trans women.

[00:26:55] They'll talk about trans women

[00:26:57] all the time

[00:26:57] in disparaging

[00:26:58] and seem to try

[00:27:00] and ignore the fact

[00:27:01] that trans men exist.

[00:27:02] I loved that.

[00:27:03] I thought it was just,

[00:27:05] it appeals to me

[00:27:06] when I see logic

[00:27:07] being used in that way.

[00:27:08] But it was interesting.

[00:27:09] I was looking at the,

[00:27:10] the sort of gender critical view

[00:27:12] on this

[00:27:12] and what they say

[00:27:13] is that men are men,

[00:27:14] women are women

[00:27:15] and trans men

[00:27:16] are just misguided women.

[00:27:18] Yeah.

[00:27:18] It doesn't work for them.

[00:27:20] You know,

[00:27:21] they paint,

[00:27:21] they paint people

[00:27:23] like us as predators

[00:27:23] in some way

[00:27:24] or as dangerous

[00:27:25] in some way

[00:27:26] and then trans men

[00:27:27] and none of it ever works.

[00:27:29] None of it as a,

[00:27:30] you can't logically

[00:27:31] work through any of this

[00:27:32] to have a,

[00:27:32] it's not a cogent position

[00:27:35] to keep really.

[00:27:36] It's a pointless one.

[00:27:37] But yeah,

[00:27:39] I don't know.

[00:27:40] It's,

[00:27:40] it's,

[00:27:41] it's,

[00:27:42] I mean,

[00:27:42] I'm going to stay up

[00:27:43] all night on,

[00:27:43] on,

[00:27:44] on Tuesday,

[00:27:44] but we won't know the results

[00:27:46] I don't think on Tuesday.

[00:27:47] No,

[00:27:47] because there'll be

[00:27:48] close in enough states

[00:27:50] for there'll be to recounts

[00:27:51] I'm sure.

[00:27:52] Yeah.

[00:27:52] And it takes a long time.

[00:27:53] You know,

[00:27:54] if it's close,

[00:27:54] it does take some time

[00:27:55] because they deal with

[00:27:56] thing where they call

[00:27:57] the result before

[00:27:58] it's actually out,

[00:27:59] don't they?

[00:27:59] Sort of thing in America

[00:28:01] that they don't actually,

[00:28:02] the result is not announced.

[00:28:04] They don't wait until

[00:28:04] all the results

[00:28:05] votes are counted

[00:28:06] like we do in the UK

[00:28:07] to,

[00:28:08] to basically a point.

[00:28:10] But,

[00:28:11] um,

[00:28:12] I'm,

[00:28:12] I've,

[00:28:12] I've put the Wednesday

[00:28:13] off,

[00:28:14] I've put the Wednesday

[00:28:14] off work.

[00:28:15] So yes,

[00:28:16] because I know I'm not going to,

[00:28:17] I'm going to stay up all night

[00:28:18] because I'm,

[00:28:19] I am heavily invested here,

[00:28:21] but I'm also a little bit

[00:28:22] terrified,

[00:28:23] um,

[00:28:24] about what the result could be.

[00:28:25] It just seems,

[00:28:26] and,

[00:28:27] and I think it's worse

[00:28:29] this time than 2016.

[00:28:30] Oh,

[00:28:31] it was always unacceptable

[00:28:32] then,

[00:28:32] but nobody expected him

[00:28:34] to win.

[00:28:34] And even then there was

[00:28:36] sort of,

[00:28:36] he didn't,

[00:28:37] he didn't expect to win.

[00:28:38] No,

[00:28:38] that's definitely true,

[00:28:39] but he was also got,

[00:28:41] he got,

[00:28:41] the thing is now he's not

[00:28:42] got any guy.

[00:28:44] They say he's got no

[00:28:44] guide rails.

[00:28:45] He's got no sensible

[00:28:46] people in his camp to try

[00:28:48] and now all those people

[00:28:49] that are now,

[00:28:50] that left his administration

[00:28:52] and are now openly calling

[00:28:55] him a fascist.

[00:28:56] These are Republicans

[00:28:56] calling him a fascist.

[00:28:58] Um,

[00:28:59] but he's got none of them.

[00:29:00] He's,

[00:29:01] the people he've got are,

[00:29:02] are just going to,

[00:29:04] you know,

[00:29:05] enable him to be even worse.

[00:29:07] I think it's just,

[00:29:08] um,

[00:29:09] scary times,

[00:29:10] but will you be,

[00:29:11] all we can do is fingers

[00:29:12] crossed and hope.

[00:29:13] Will you be watching it,

[00:29:13] Jill?

[00:29:14] Will you be,

[00:29:14] yeah,

[00:29:15] well,

[00:29:15] I'll be,

[00:29:15] um,

[00:29:16] I'm speaking at a conference

[00:29:17] on the Wednesday,

[00:29:18] so,

[00:29:18] um,

[00:29:18] I do need some beauty sleep

[00:29:20] because it's all about

[00:29:21] trans rights.

[00:29:22] So,

[00:29:22] um,

[00:29:23] I need to be,

[00:29:24] you don't need much

[00:29:24] beauty sleep,

[00:29:25] Jill.

[00:29:26] You always,

[00:29:26] that's very kind.

[00:29:27] Luckily,

[00:29:28] lots of makeup and wigs

[00:29:29] seem to help,

[00:29:30] but I wouldn't,

[00:29:31] I wouldn't call it beauty

[00:29:32] at this stage of my age

[00:29:33] in life.

[00:29:33] But look,

[00:29:34] fingers crossed,

[00:29:35] I'm sure we'll be in,

[00:29:36] we'll be chatting on the

[00:29:37] night and,

[00:29:38] um,

[00:29:38] I don't think we need to

[00:29:39] do a live podcast feed

[00:29:41] all night.

[00:29:41] I think that,

[00:29:43] I'm not sure we're going

[00:29:44] to pull much of an audience

[00:29:45] away from the,

[00:29:47] from the main channels.

[00:29:48] Um,

[00:29:49] but definitely we can do

[00:29:50] a bit of a,

[00:29:51] we'll see what happens.

[00:29:52] I think it's going to be

[00:29:52] very interesting.

[00:29:54] So fingers crossed.

[00:29:55] Let's keep our hope.

[00:29:56] We need a bit of good,

[00:29:57] we need a bit of good

[00:29:58] news.

[00:29:58] I think so.

[00:29:59] Yeah.

[00:29:59] All I'm going to say is

[00:30:00] this,

[00:30:00] that about,

[00:30:01] uh,

[00:30:02] nine months before our,

[00:30:03] the UK general election,

[00:30:04] I was saying to you,

[00:30:05] it's all going to be fine.

[00:30:06] It's going to be fine.

[00:30:07] This,

[00:30:07] the Labour party are doing

[00:30:09] the things that they're

[00:30:09] doing because it'll get

[00:30:10] them into power.

[00:30:11] And you were very doom

[00:30:12] and gloom and it's worked

[00:30:14] out just as we said.

[00:30:15] So I'm,

[00:30:15] I'm sort of confident

[00:30:16] it's going to be all right.

[00:30:18] It's been a bit terrible

[00:30:18] for the first few months.

[00:30:19] I'm really honest with you.

[00:30:20] And I remember they

[00:30:22] haven't been a bit

[00:30:22] terrible out of practice.

[00:30:24] Yeah.

[00:30:24] That's a great excuse.

[00:30:26] Yeah.

[00:30:26] We're incompetent because

[00:30:27] we've just been out of

[00:30:28] practice.

[00:30:29] Yeah.

[00:30:29] Um,

[00:30:30] but anyway,

[00:30:31] yes.

[00:30:32] look forward to it.

[00:30:32] Anyway,

[00:30:33] well,

[00:30:33] we'll see you.

[00:30:34] I guess we'll see you all

[00:30:34] next week.

[00:30:35] This time next week.

[00:30:36] We'll know.

[00:30:37] Well,

[00:30:37] who knows?

[00:30:38] Yes.

[00:30:39] Or we might've all emigrated

[00:30:40] or behind it in a bunker.

[00:30:42] Where's our nearest bunker?

[00:30:43] Do we need to know?

[00:30:43] Can you say that?

[00:30:44] I've got a holiday book

[00:30:45] next year in the States

[00:30:46] and I'm thinking to myself,

[00:30:47] if,

[00:30:48] if they're,

[00:30:48] if they've taken over,

[00:30:50] am I going to go?

[00:30:50] I mean,

[00:30:51] you know,

[00:30:51] whereabouts are you going?

[00:30:53] Is it?

[00:30:53] Start in New York

[00:30:53] and finish in Florida.

[00:30:55] Oh,

[00:30:55] New York would be fine.

[00:30:56] Florida,

[00:30:57] less so,

[00:30:58] I guess.

[00:30:59] Flights,

[00:31:00] you know,

[00:31:01] tax rises,

[00:31:02] hikes,

[00:31:02] tariffs on flights

[00:31:03] and cruises

[00:31:04] and such like.

[00:31:05] So,

[00:31:06] I'm a bit,

[00:31:08] I've got to,

[00:31:09] I've got to do some lobbying

[00:31:10] because I'm not sure

[00:31:11] that I particularly want to go

[00:31:12] if it's going to turn

[00:31:12] that way.

[00:31:14] Yeah,

[00:31:14] yeah,

[00:31:14] it doesn't sound,

[00:31:15] it's not the destination

[00:31:17] of choice anymore.

[00:31:17] It's a cruise

[00:31:17] and you know what I'm like,

[00:31:18] I'm very,

[00:31:19] you know.

[00:31:20] Yeah,

[00:31:20] we've done the cruise this year.

[00:31:23] Yeah,

[00:31:23] you'd be fine out on the sea.

[00:31:24] It's probably better to be

[00:31:25] in international waters

[00:31:27] when it all kicks off.

[00:31:28] That's true.

[00:31:28] You know,

[00:31:28] when World War III happens,

[00:31:29] I think I'd rather be on a ship

[00:31:31] in the middle of the ocean

[00:31:32] away from it all.

[00:31:34] Yeah,

[00:31:34] yeah,

[00:31:34] yeah,

[00:31:35] you could do that.

[00:31:36] Anyways.

[00:31:37] And on that cheerful note,

[00:31:38] see you next week.

[00:31:39] See you all next week.

[00:31:40] Bye.

[00:31:41] Bye.

[00:31:43] Bye.

[00:31:44] Thanks for listening

[00:31:45] to this episode of Transvox.

[00:31:47] It's been a joy

[00:31:48] to have you with us.

[00:31:49] If you want to

[00:31:49] make contact with us,

[00:31:51] you can contact us

[00:31:52] at jillian

[00:31:53] at transvox.co.uk

[00:31:55] and all of our money

[00:31:57] goes to our nominated charity.

[00:31:59] And Jen,

[00:32:00] you've chosen the charity

[00:32:01] for the next number of episodes.

[00:32:03] Which one have you chosen?

[00:32:04] Our charity is called

[00:32:05] Beyond Reflections,

[00:32:07] which is a charity

[00:32:08] that provides support

[00:32:09] and counselling

[00:32:10] to trans people,

[00:32:11] non-binary people

[00:32:13] and their families

[00:32:14] across the UK.

[00:32:16] An amazing charity

[00:32:17] doing some amazing work,

[00:32:18] really important.

[00:32:19] So please,

[00:32:20] if you can give.

[00:32:21] Great.

[00:32:22] And if you want to go

[00:32:22] and have a look

[00:32:23] at Beyond Reflections,

[00:32:24] it's beyond-reflections.org.uk.

[00:32:27] But as I say,

[00:32:28] if you'd like to make

[00:32:28] a contribution

[00:32:29] to what we're doing

[00:32:30] because we love

[00:32:30] to help the people

[00:32:31] who help us.

[00:32:32] Again,

[00:32:33] if you've got ideas

[00:32:33] for the show,

[00:32:35] things you'd like

[00:32:36] to ask us,

[00:32:37] questions,

[00:32:37] comments,

[00:32:38] applause,

[00:32:38] or brickbaths,

[00:32:40] feel free

[00:32:41] to send it all in

[00:32:41] to Gillian

[00:32:42] at franzvox.co.uk.

[00:32:45] Until the next time,

[00:32:46] goodbye.

[00:32:47] Bye-bye.